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Next Toon manager: Shearer v Hughton.

Posted on October 15th, 2009 | 135 Comments |

Next permanent manager?
Next permanent manager?
Nicky Butt has recently called for Chris Hughton to be made permanent manager of Newcastle United, but what are the options?

Apparently Derek Llambias will shortly be reviewing the positions of Hughton and Calderwood in light of our great start and Nicky Butt hopes that their positions are made permanent until the end of the season. Butt said:

The team is showing there is belief here, and Chris and Colin deserve the job now.

Hopefully they get it and that will mean we can all concentrate on the job in hand.

People keep looking at us and say ‘they still haven’t got a proper manager’ even though Chris is acting manager.

He’s not done anything wrong, but he hasn’t been named as boss.

So it would be nice to see Chris get the job.”

Personally I don’t want to see a manager appointed ‘for the rest of the season’ – I’d rather see someone appointed for 3-5 years. The frequent changes of manager have been one of Newcastle’s main problems and one of the reasons why we were relegated last season. We need to get away from this short-termism.

However, Ashley’s only here for the short-term so appointing someone ‘for the rest of the season’ is probably as long-term as he’s likely to be. If he did appoint Hughton for that period of time, I think it would indicate that the club’s unlikely to be sold this season. If he still believes he can sell the club this season then I doubt Ashley will appoint a permanent manager.

But what of Shearer? Rumour has it that he’s the first choice of Barry Moat and a lot of fans are now treating the Toon manager situation as a straight Shearer v Hughton fight.

It is difficult to compare the two in my opinion and a lot of nonsense is talked about both. They were both equally unsuccessful at managing Newcastle in the Premiership last season, although I don’t think that short spells of management under such difficult circumstances provide much of an indication of a manager’s abilities.

A manager, I believe, needs a pre-season, a chance to bring in one or two players or their own and the continuity of then managing right through a season and into the next one before they can be properly judged. Hughton is on his way towards achieving that and maybe that provides a good argument for keeping him on.

But do Hughton’s results flatter him? He has after all got a team that’s largely full of Premier League players – even if they’re not brilliant ones – and has been given the opportunity to see them through pre-season and bring in some loan players. I would argue that any half-decent manager who was appointed in Hughton’s place at the start of this pre-season would have stood a good chance of producing similar results. However someone had to do it and Hughton did. What I’m saying is that although I stand by what I said about ‘any half-decent manager’, I can’t fault Hughton’s results – he has been asked to do a job and has done it well.

A lot of tripe is talked about Shearer though. Some mention his ‘big ego’ but I think that’s irrelevant. A big ego has hardly been a barrier for Alex Ferguson, Arsene Wenger or Jose Mourinho has it? And when does confidence become a big ego anyway? Some also mention his poor spell as manager last season yet, as I mentioned above, Hughton had an equally unspectacular spell as manager last season and – again as I’ve already stated – I just don’t think either manager can be judged on last season given the circumstances.

One valid concern about Shearer though is his lack of experience. Shearer fans will point to managers who’ve succeeded despite a lack of experience and maybe they have a point, but it’s still a concern. Then there’s those who worry about Shearer merely being the next ‘Geordie Messiah’ and feel that it’s wrong to keep looking for Geordie Messiah’s like this. I can see where they’re coming from and I do believe it would be healthier if we stopped looking for ‘Geordie Messiahs’ but that alone is no reason to deny Shearer his chance. He’s there, throwing his hat in the ring and he must be evaluated on what he can do for the club in the long-term as a manager.

If Hughton wants to strenghten his case in my eyes (and what manager wouldn’t?) then I’d like to see him come up with some plans as to how he’s going to approach things for the next 3-5 years; how he’s going to rebuild the Toon as a Premier League club capable of challenging for European places in 3-5 years time; and how he’s going to do that on a relatively modest budget. For all I know he may already have such a plan, but I have no knowledge of it so I can’t factor that into my own thoughts. I know that Shearer did that.

So who would I like to see as manager? Well give me Arsene Wenger or Martin O’Neill and both Shearer and Hughton can take a running jump as far as I’m concerned but of course that’s unrealistic. Of the names connected with Newcastle I favoured Curbishley but it seems he’s not interested. I’d prefer either Shearer or Hughton to David O’Leary or Joe Kinnear but as to choosing between Shearer and Hughton I simply can’t. Hughton simply doesn’t inspire me or strike me as a man with a vision, whereas Shearer does. Yet Hughton is doing a fine job now and – regardless of any excuses we care to make about the circumstances – we can’t take that away from him: he has us 3 points clear at the top of the Championship and that’s got to be worth something. Sometimes the quiet man is the one you need.

I think that with the right owner Newcastle United is capable of doing what Aston Villa or Everton have done, which is to challenge for Europe on a relatively modest budget. I think that sort of aim is both ambitious and realistic and I think it’s what we should be planning for right now. It needs the right manager to make it happen though and I don’t know if that’s Shearer, Hughton or somebody else – I’m just glad it’s a decision I don’t have to make!

NUFCBlog Author: Hugh de Payen I'm a baby-boomer of the punk rock persuasion, currently exiled in Somerset for crimes committed in a previous life where locals keep trying to poison me with something called 'scrumpy'. Hates sprouts, coat-hangers, Cilla Black, ornaments, Steven Seagull movies and 50 Cent (he's not worth 10). Hugh de Payen has written 634 articles on this blog.

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135 Responses

  1. i like the article a lot. its well written as well but i don’t like either shearer or hughton as they are both tactically short when it comes to winning dirty which we may need to do.
    Our last 2 home results have been draws which should have been wins in my opinion and this shows that we cant win ugly.
    Last season neither man could inspire players who are supposed to be world class ?

    We need a confident experienced man who has had a number of years in management and who has a lot of years left also.

    Newcastle being the soap opera it is an american consortium will buy it and put Keegan in which once we start winning and everything else is forgotten might not be a bad thing as i am damned if i know who could be our best option to manage our great club.

    regards

    D

  2. Gordon Strachan? Shearer would be my first choice no one else will get a fair crack at it until Shearers had a go but I do think he will do a great job with someone like John Carver along side him. Houghton has done a good job but when the going gets tuff is he strong enough to get the best out of players when their heads are down? I don’t thinks so.

  3. Who cares what Nicky Butt thinks? – he should concentrate on trying to pass the ball to his team-mates…

    Who cares what Llambias’s judgement is about Hughton and Calderwood? The man admitted lying to the fans, why should we trust his judgement or anything he says?

    Until we get the Barrowboy and hos cronies out of our club, we can’t plan or move forward on ANY long term issues.

  4. Agree with UTD111 post #3. As long as Ashley is in charge it is going to be very hard to build a team with him wanting to win but not spend much money. A few injuries and the team will be crocked.

  5. Hughton and Calderwood are Ashleys boys doing his bidding and going along with his plan without making a squeak of protest, Shearer on the other hand has balls and told Ashley some painful home truths about his shambles of a regime, the result is there for all to see.
    I want the manager that feels the pain as much as the fans and is prepared to do something about it even though he will suffer along the way, that man is Shearer, not the yes man nodding dog we have at the moment.

  6. Good point UTD Butt has been cantering his way to retirement since he was discarded by Manu and is the type of player we do not need He is unrecognisable from the player he was at man u. This more of a swipe at Shearer than an endorsment of Houghton. I think Shearer might take less crap from so called ‘stars’

    Rant over

  7. simply on the issue of experience, Shearer may not have that much but nor did KK when we rose the first time, he gave the players passion because he was passionate and I think Shearer would do the same, Hughton has done an exceptional job, and just because he couldn’t inspire similar results in the prem is irrelevant, there were 10 more players here then, maybe the smaller group have pulled together stronger just like the remining players say, besides, if they do give Shearer the job, he’d be daft not to want Hughton to stay on board to help him

  8. Belfasttoon – no, I’d be happy with Strachan as an option too. But it would still require a change in ownership as I don’t think any credible manager would come and work for this lot…..

  9. Shearer passionate? Perhaps, but not in the same way Keegan was/is. Shearer has the personality of a breeze block. Keegan was able to convince a vegetarian that eating a Big Mac was OK, he was that good a man motivator. Shearer doesn’t have the charisma that Keegan had. You want to compare Shearer to a past NUFC manager then look at Kenny Daglish.

  10. Shearer had his chance – he was in prime position sat across the table talking about how to move forward – he did have a plan – but it involved too much money – so it wasnt a plan at all – it was a egotists demands.

    CH is doing well – we dont personally know him – but those who do are responding to him – I think the quiet strong man deserves a chance. Shearer had his and he blew it.

  11. would shearer not just cause unrest?,i could see him falling out with the player,s.
    we could end up with shearer acting a bit like sourness,if he has a difference of opinion with certain players.
    me personally would not have shearer or hughton,i do agree with utd 11,when ashley sacked big sam and the keegan fiasco no manager with integrity will work for a cheap con man like ashley.
    that is why i cannot understand why he just doesn,t take the first decent offer available to him.
    mike ashley isn,t just finished at newcastle but football in general,the guy hasn,t one shred of
    credibility left in the game.
    ashley seems to be stuck with old pals,cronies,never were,s and people like hughton who were already there because proper footballing people wouldn,t touch him with a bargepole.
    i also agree that this club cannot move forward until ashley leaves.

  12. Stardust is both right and wrong.

    Shearer had a plan that involved too much money as far as Ashley is concerned. Stardust’s right about that.

    However Stardust is wrong when he says it was an ‘egotists demand’ and that he ‘blew it’. It was simply that Ashley wasn’t prepared to back a long-term rebuilding plan and chose to sell the club instead.

  13. Hitman – Shearer wanted the job – Ashley and Llambias wanted him and talked with him for 2 days (otherwise why meet) – there was the famous “what am I to do ” picture of Ashley at the training ground talking to DL whilst in negotiations.

    AS was the preferred man BUT something happened in that meeting that meant they couldnt do it – Season tickets by the thousand would have been sold if he was appointed – so something major was in the way – certainly the will to do it was there.

    The only thing that can be deduced is that the plans or demands whatever they were – could not be afforded – and the merry-go-round of players in and out on huge salaries could not continue. Ashley bailed out – guess he had deja vu for a third time.

  14. Hough – I was just playing with that line – put more in line as I see it – A long term plan can be prudent it doesnt have to involve huge sums of money (a la Wenger)

    I do think he blew it – as he never thought about Ashleys position, he made it untenable by the demand – Ashley only had one course of action – to sell – maybe the Shearer moat bid was to take advantage of that and thats why Ashley wont sell at a discount to Moat.

    Cant reply any more – off and away for the day. Cheers

  15. One other thing – Shearer showed in the handling of the Joey Barton incident he can not handle problems – he went way out of remit and stated Barton would never play for the club again – he was only a caretaker manager – who did he think he was?

  16. Journal is reporting this morning that Ashley has told Hughton there will be no transfer budget at all in January which is a sad indictment of his lack of interest and ambition for the club.
    But also, some will applaud Hughton for getting on with the job regardless but he is being shown a huge lack of respect by Ashley who is treating him as a mug, i feel sorry for him because if it all goes pear shaped, and it will with a few more injuries, Hughton is going to be right in the firing line by failing to stand up to the bully boys.
    The club, as it stands now, is like an out of body bad experience, we can all see something bad is about to happen but you can do nothing about it

  17. Stardust, all we know is that Shearer took a plan of some sort to Ashley and then Ashley – either as a result of that plan or not (we don’t know) – chose to sell the club instead.

    We are merely speculating about whether Shearer’s plan was prudent or not. Personally I think he’s bright enough to know that we need to get away from spending ludicrous sums of money on transfer fees and wages, but also honest enough to point out that a certain financial commitment is necessary over a period of 3-5 years.

    As to Barton, I think he handled him well. That’s the way Barton should have been handled long ago IMHO and I think it was in Shearer’s remit to decide who played and who didn’t. I don’t remember Shearer saying that Barton would never play for the club again, merely that he wouldn’t play for the club while he was manager.

  18. stardust he was and still is mr newcastle united and if you prefer ashley to alan shearer thats fine by me it just shows your not a real toon fan >>>ps do you have homosexual dreams aboot FAT ASH ?

  19. ha . Nora ,
    stardust is clueless as you know. We all know how he thinks. He is the only person who supports ashley. Its clear ashley wants one thing only as a manager and thats a puppet. Shearer was never going to be a puppet however hooters fits the bill.
    Im not having a go at hooters, hes been put in a job, not at his request and done it well this season. However, as has been mentioned, any competent coach / manager could have achieved similar results with this squad. The test of a good manager is how they handle the role following poor results.
    As far as his comment on joey barton is concerned, shearer has every right to tell players they wont play again. How do you create discipline within the dressing room without that power?
    Fergie and wenger rule by that power and their success speaks for themselves.
    So lets all sing together. Lets all laugh at stardust, lets all laugh at stardust, la , la, la, la, la, la, la, la.

  20. ANYONE PLEASE!

    I’ve cried out for stability for years. Personally my choice would be Shearer on a five year contract with Hughton as head coach. I feel it’s harsh on Chris, but Shearer’s appointment would show that the club intends on making a real push at getting back amongst the big boys and the big names, which sadly is what the Premiership is all about.

    But I think the reality is we won’t see anyone appointed for the rest of the season, when Ashley will decide to either sell up or keep the club. If he sells, I think Shearer will get the job, if he stays I reckon Hughton will be given a short term (2-3 years) contract.

  21. lets all be happy and have Keegan back. :)

    least we would get promoted

    like the quote about shearer having personality of a breeze block lol

    Alan is with out a doubt the greatest player in our history but having no experience is a really big gamble.

    I like the shout for strachan though as he would be a good choice.

    lets wait to see if we are sold and hope the new owners are ambitious and can bring in an experienced ambitious manager.

  22. What the club and the supporters need to realise is that we’ve got to stop messing about with signing up ex playing legends to manage us.

    Gerard Houlier would have been an excellent choice for us, but instead we got Keegan. We need to wake up and stop being so damn niave and romantic about the people who manage the team.
    When Fergie retires will ManU fans start clamouring for Bruce, Robson, Cantona etc.. to become manager? No they won’t. First of all the first two have a track record in management and it isn’t great and the third one is a French legend with no managerial experience at all. Loved by the fans and a legend in football, but a manager? No way. ManU will do it right and probably appoint Jose or perhaps they’ll get Capello off the back of an England World Cup exit.
    In my opinion there are still too many people who think that we can get by on wooly, daft romantic ideas that former playing legends are the only ones who can save the club. Yes, they can save us on the pitch by scoring a last minute goal, but off the pitch it’s a different matter all together.
    Shearer is a short term, short sighted, narrow minded appointment and we will find ourselves back where we are in a couple of seasons time, should it happen.

  23. Micky Toon

    I agree 100%. I don’t know why people persist in likening Shearer’s potential man management skills to those of Keegan. Keegan was an inspiring man who could convince people to die for the cause despite the obstacles in the way. His motivational abilities were there for all to see, same as Shearer’s aren’t. My worry is Shearer’s ego and the unrest that can cause. Yes his fantastic playing career will earn him a level of respect initially from the players, but that respect can be quickly lost by poor decision making or a bit of an attitude. Respect in a job has to be won. He may have respect for his achievements as as an ex player, will he get it as a manager, different job, different skill set? Not convinced at all, but if he’s appointed I will support him as the manager.
    I hope common sense kick’s in and we appoint an experienced manager. I’ve always liked David Jones, cuurently with Cardiff. Was showing good potential until all the bad stuff with the papers kicked off, but glad to see he’s back in football and doing ok again

  24. All our opinions about Shearer as a manager are purely subjective. We simply don’t know what he’ll be like, which is the main problem with his appointment IMHO.

    We can’t really judge much on his stint last season; a point which is somewhat demonstrated by Hughton whose record was dreadful last season yet he seems to be doing okay now.

  25. The history of Newcastle United is an example to the world that fans know xxxx all about football, and shouldn’t be allowed to interfere with the running of a club. We are a complete joke.

  26. worky,it,s not just newcastle these things have always happened in football.
    last season arsenal,spurs,liverpool and others were guilty of booing players managers etc.
    these teams were near the top of the league,so i think this shows how good newcastle fans are imo.
    in the 80,s we had the boo boys,so these situations are not a new phenomena,just political correctness gone mad.
    remember when frank mcevennie was playing for west ham,he was seeing a page 3 bird,chants of we,ve all seen your lasses tits.
    it,s part and parcel of the game,always has been and shouldn,t be taken out.
    if your a player,manager,owner etc and your not producing on the pitch ,training field,board room etc then the fans have every right to vocalise their dissatisfaction.
    the fans are paying their wages and should be allowed their point of view.
    in other countries the fans are an integral part of the club and have a say on all decisions.
    i think newcastle have the best set of fans in the country,so when i hear the words insular inbred and other insults it,s totally harsh imo.

  27. The main reason I want Alan Shearer to be manager is the same as the reason Ashley doesn’t want him to. If Shearer is in control he has full control beacuse he has the full backing of the fans,if a player steps out of line noone will question Shearers handling of it if he makes a misstake it’s genuine if he falls out with the board/ owner it’s not his fault.

    So if Shearer is incharge he has full control Ashley cannot sack him and has less control over his own club

  28. worky – and do you suggest we just sit back and watch Ashley carry out football genocide on our club?

  29. Trojan,

    My point wasn’t that fans of other clubs don’t boo players and managers occaisionally, though at least they pipe down after awhile and don’t go on about it obsessively like spoiled children. My point was more that the various hierarchies in charge at Newcastle United have pandered to whims of the perpetual dissenters at the club throughout it’s history, with catastrophic consequences.

  30. Belfast, ‘Genocide’ is the sytematic mass murder of a group based on ethnicity, religion, nationality etc. I don’t really see what that has to do with football or Mike Ashley TBH.

  31. sepp blatter says that russia have a good chance of hosting the world cup………. i seriousely hope not even if england dont win it i do not want russia to either

  32. Belfasttoon says:
    October 15, 2009 at 4:10 pm (Edit)

    “Worky thanks ?…..but I was talking about my post”

    Belfast,

    Your post about Shearer being the only person who is tolerable for the fans, the only person who will not be driven out, the only person who will be given a chance to succeed is exactly the kind of thing I was writing about.

    It’s a very sad situation.

  33. worky it us sad but their is nothing we can do except hope for an owner that will take what ever the fans throw at him

  34. worky,i understand what your saying,my point was that i dont want all newcastle fans tarred with the same.. brush.
    i can be in the pub talking about ashley,the club,the players etc and you will hear all different points of view.
    what i dont like is the constant media misrepresentation of the people of tyneside as morons,inbreds,lunatics because it,s just not true.

  35. Personally I say the utmost key reason for our downfall for the last 5 years has been the lack of a permanent manager, a decent one at that too.

    I’d leave Hughton in the job (until it looks like we may not get promoted) and the next owner has to appoint a great manager.

    Steve Coppell? Maybe aim a bit higher; Gerrard Houllier? I would, if he’s given the money.

    We need an EXPERIENCED, reknowned manager, and I believe Houllier would bring us not only survival, but Europe again once we’re back up a league.

  36. Hugh very interesting article I think that once Big Al told Ma that he would need more than a tenner that was the end of that. As for hughton I have allways said that he was a decent honest hardworking man that will never rock the boat or make demands and finds it hard to say no, is that the type of manager we want. Before anyone things I am just anti hughton im not I have a lot of respect for Hughton and I know he is a real good Coach but to be honest I think he isnt much more than a puppet for Ma who will just except whatever Ma gives him. No matter who is manager no one will get the time needed to built a team until big Al has had the chance, and I think stability is 1 of the most important things that our club needs so no better time to give Al a go he might proof his doubters wrong and if not atlest he wont be a saddle on the back of any other manager that gets the job

  37. Dave all respect but what are you on about?

    In fact on the matter, how can anybody with any NUFC in their heart criticise Hughton?

    “He’s a puppet for Mike Ashley”, or the popular one when we lose a game “He’s a rubbish coach and will never make it, get rid!” These seems to be quite shared views on Hughton, and you’re all wrong.

    Chris Hughton is a football coach, not a football manager. He hasn’t even been given the respect to be appointed manager until the end of the season. Yet every single day, come rain or shine, £100million or £1 from Mike Ashley, he turns up to train the team and take the ridiculous amount of stick when a team he hasn’t been given funds to improve don’t turn out results.

    He deserves a huge bloody recognition from all fans I reckon. Some people would rather sooner have Keegan back than appoint Hughton, and it’s unbelievable.

    Hughton’s doing a hell of a lot more than Shearer has ever done in terms of enthusiasm to taking charge at the club.

  38. Dave, i get what you’re saying mate, but isn’t it sad that we feel we have to take yet another massive risk & appoint Shearer, just to get him out of our system?
    Don’t get me wrong, i’d love Shearer to come in & kick ass, but if it all gans belly up, it could really snarl up the whole thing yet again.
    We need the stability that a 5/10 year manager would undoubtedly bring.
    Can we afford to take that gamble & risk further upheaval?

  39. Andy, well said.
    Hughton has jumped in 3 times now (is it?).
    He’s more than a yes man, he’s a seasoned coach & a top one at that. He knows what’s expected of him & is trying to deliver under enormous pressure from us, MA, the press & anyone else that feels like having a pop.

  40. AndyNUFC > Dave all respect but what are you on about?
    ??? Andy what part are you on about ?
    CLiNT FLiCK I agree with what your saying, that its a big risk to take, but that is the nature of our Club not my no1 plan.

  41. HUTON IS A STUPOID COCKNY PRICK AND WILL NEVER BE A MANAGR WE NEED TO GET SHERER BACK IN B4 ITS TOO LATTE!!!

  42. Sad but true Dave.
    But, if we don’t change & soon, we will be destined to keep repeating this same mistake in perpetuity. A line must be drawn soon.
    Believe me mate, i don’t know the answer, but part of it is a culture change-A sea change.
    The club has got itself in one hell of a vortex down the years, MA is just the current hell on a stick.
    Surely there’s someone out there with the nous(& cash) to come in force a proper plan onto this club & reap the rewards (finacial & otherwise).
    This is actually one hell of an opportunity for some brave soul.

  43. PROUD GEORDIE says:
    October 15, 2009 at 6:50 pm

    “WE NEED TO GET SHERER BACK IN B4 ITS TOO LATTE!!!”

    PG, are you saying that if Shearer isn’t appointed soon, Newcastle United will drown in a sea of milky coffee? :-)

  44. Clint > This is actually one hell of an opportunity for some brave soul.
    I couldnt have said it better myself. But unless we get bought out by a multi billionaire I dont think we will get back to where we were, I think we have to settle for top 10’s as I cant see any other teams challenging the top 4-5 so 5-10 would do me.

  45. Dave just when you referred to him as a yes man. I don’t get what you mean by that, because regardless of who is coach/manager, Mike Ashley is owner and no matter how demanding the relevant coach is, they simply can’t force the owner to give them any amount of money.

    As much as you refer to Hughton as a yes man, and others do, they somehow think that Shearer, by not taking on the job, is a ‘no man’ and “courageously stands up against the pantomime villain Ashley”. But he’s not a hero. He’s not jumping at the chance of the job simply because he’s such a protestor. Alan Shearer only wants it, like Keegan, when he’s garunteed success and recognition.

    Hughton will do the job just for the honour of working the position at such a high level club, and that’s what seperates them. If Shearer wants to be a manager he can go and earn it.

  46. PROUD GEORDIE

    What kind of a comment is that? Hughtons done a decent job for us, your living proof that man can live without a brain!

  47. Dave, i reckon with the right owner, the right manager & the fans in full support-Anything can happen at this club.
    It’s happened before & it can again.
    & if really done correctly, it doesn’t have to be based on hoying good money after bad. Cos a real manager should be able to spot talent early & not have to break the bank.
    Also, they should be able to spend wisely on finished articles. We need to stop trying to buy success, it’s better to build it, but that takes time.
    We actually have that opportunity now.
    Don’t you think?

  48. Andy as a Yes man I am not only talking about to Ma, but to the senior players aswell even in Bartons case he picked him while not being fully fit and carrying a foot injury, over young Guthrie and R Taylor because it was easier to say yes to Joey than say sorry but no your not playing to the youguns (Guthrie and R Taylor) He is a top bloke and the type of coach you would love to work under but he will except all sorts of sh1te that is thrown at him without complaining and standing his ground he will just get on with it. That is why I dont think he is the answer as a much needed longterm Manager

  49. Clint @ 59 agree 100% ;) The only think that scares me is that even with the likes of Martin Oniel, Moyes, or any other Manager wont get the time, one bad season and they will be calling for the Managers head while the ghost of Big Al is in the background.

  50. Toon_Factor says:
    October 15, 2009 at 7:25 pm

    “PROUD GEORDIE

    What kind of a comment is that? Hughtons done a decent job for us, your living proof that man can live without a brain!”

    Toon, it isn’t actually that much different from what alot of the fans are saying, only they put it in more polite terms and use logical fallacies to put him down more subtly.

    For instance, because he doesn’t walk out like a big crybaby when he doesn’t get his own way, that makes him a “yes man”. Because he’s a “nice bloke”, he’s incapable of being a football manager apparently, unlike nasty bastards like Bobby Robson and Roy Hodgson etc. :-)

  51. And worst of all, we must get rid of Hughton because the fans won’t give him a chance. What kind of perverted logic is that? And what does it say about the fans?

  52. Big Dave says:
    October 15, 2009 at 8:08 pm

    “Worky do you see Hughton as the longterm Manager ?”

    Dave, I don’t know if I see anyone as a “long term manager” at Newcastle. They are all driven out in the end, even Joe Harvey and Bobby Robson.

  53. whatever worky

    I personally would like to see tony pulis as manager but i know all of you will disagree.

  54. The trouble is, Worky, I don’t think there’s an immediate solution to that. I think the a lot of fans will have learnt some lessons from the events of the last 2-3 years but by no means all of them.

    I think stability would help. We need an owner who’s prepared to make long-term plans, appoint his chosen personnel and stick to them, and also to be strong enough to ignore the fans if necessary.

    Give us 3-5 years of stability and generally upward progress on the pitch and I think things will settle down. Maybe not completely, but to some extent.

  55. Hugh de Payen says:
    October 15, 2009 at 8:24 pm

    “The trouble is, Worky, I don’t think there’s an immediate solution to that.”

    Why does the solution have to be “immediate”, Hugh? Expecting immediate solutions is what causes most of the problems in the first place.

  56. It doesn’t have to be immediate and I certainly don’t expect it to be. As I said, I think it’s a 3-5 year solution (minimum).

  57. Worky > Dave, I don’t know if I see anyone as a “long term manager” at Newcastle. They are all driven out in the end, even Joe Harvey and Bobby Robson.
    I think your right and I also think it could be a cultural thing.
    Hugh > I think the a lot of fans will have learnt some lessons from the events of the last 2-3 years but by no means all of them.
    I think your right alot of them have learnt that success is Not a god given right, funny enough after KK came out with the top 4 being unbreakable statment, I noticed alot of peoples attitudes on .com changing. I would love us to be like an astonvilla or even everton type team that will allways be builting slowly but consistently

  58. Chris Hughton has done a man’s job, thus far, shepherding us through the choppy waters of The Championship. He’s an honest, even tempered, affable guy who has worked miracles in the sort of circumstances that would have flattened more experienced men than he. If I had a hat…it would be off to Chris Hughton. Is he the man to takes us on for the next ten years? Sadly, no. And that is no reflection on either the job he has done, or is doing.

    The Championship is a quagmire. A writhing mass of physical conflict that punctures form like a balloon. We’ve remained atop it because of our own endeavour, but also because no one has put together a run to knock us off. This league will not be won at a canter….we’re but one of a dozen teams that can win it. Chris’ proving ground is yet to be faced!

    If he does achieve promotion then what? How would he fare in the Premier League? Against more experienced managers with bigger budgets, and more committed owners….I doubt we’d last a season.

    With “sources” whispering of no transfer money in January, Ashley to stick it out til next season and Hughton and Calderwood appointed full time…I don’t see much future in our future, Hughton has done enough to merit a crack at the job full time….but what then?

    We should be building, for possible promotion, now….not making do! Ashley wants to scrimp and wait for one reason, and one reason only….to flog us for more money once promoted. That’s the only thing that motivates him to do anything! Without new owners and new impetus…promotion would be a fleeting joy.

    As for who should manage us long term….I really don’t need to say it, do I?

    Keegan, the past. Hughton, the present. The future?

    SUPERSHEARER!

  59. tf

    proud geordie is a wum i am guessing worky ?? possibly to make a point if it is you worky nice touch on the spelling mistakes

  60. Hughton is doing an alright job. But only alright. He too had a poor record in the Premiership (like Shearer) He too has no managerial experience (like Shearer) He is a half decent coach on a good wage and he is being asked to take a particular role by the man who pays those wages. He is under no pressure, he carries no great expectations. If it all goes wrong, he didn’t want the job, couldn’t sign anyone, too many injuries etc. He is in a no lose situation. If he ‘fails’, and someone else is brought in, he may go back to his day job being a half decent coach, or he will have his contract paid up and go on to coach at another club, his reputation as a coach untarnished. If, as I suspect, he has realised that our bunch of under performing ‘stars’ from last season have found their level and could, with a fair wind, few injuries and a bit of luck, go on to gain promotion from a pretty poor league, well he just may have found himself the dream job he never wanted. Will he succeed if we gain promotion back to the Premier? Will he be able to motivate players in a struggling side? Will he attract players with ability and promise when we will no longer be flashing the cash on wages or transfer fees? I think we all know the answers to these questions. Will Shearer be any better? Who knows?
    Without a queue, full of top managers with experience and a proven track record at the highest level (whilst working with minimal funds), forming around the Gallowgate our choices are limited.
    I’d give a certain Mr. Shearer a bash. Who knows? he might bring his boots.

  61. Hughton’s limited experience is still more than Shearer’s though.
    Maybe if Shearer had took the job, with the limitations it came with, it would be him now with that experience & a good bargaining position. Then when ashley ‘makes like a tree’, he would be kept on by the new owner/s, bob’s your aunt & fanny’s your uncle, hey presto, etc.

  62. Hmmm…Newcastle fans are knee-jerkers par excellence, yet according to some Chris Hughton should be given the permanent job after 11 games in the Championship and Shearer written off after 8 games in the Premier League? Rightio.

    How about an experienced, proven Manager instead?

  63. The clue is in the title though, like.
    Shearer v Hughton.
    I’m with you mind.
    Then you’re into the realm of ‘who would take it’ (today)territory.
    Compile a list ShiverMeTimbre.

  64. Tino 11 says:
    October 15, 2009 at 9:25 pm

    “Worky who would you like to be appointed full time manager, assuming it was for a few years?”

    Fabio Capello.

    summerof69 says:
    October 15, 2009 at 9:26 pm

    “proud geordie is a wum i am guessing worky ?? possibly to make a point if it is you worky nice touch on the spelling mistakes”

    Certainly not, 69. Sock puppetry isn’t my sort of thing at all, especially on one of my own websites as that would destroy it’s (and my) integrity and would be stupid. If it was me, he or she would be a damn sight funnier than that anyway. :-)

    It almost certainly isn’t batty or Stardust either. Some people really are just radged.

  65. Alright batty,
    Aye, fair enough, but he did a 2 day interview didn’t he?
    That means they had a good long chat. I know we don’t know what was said/unsaid, but obviously they couldn’t reach agreement, let’s say.

  66. workyticket says:
    October 15, 2009 at 10:09 pm

    Tino 11 says:
    October 15, 2009 at 9:25 pm

    “Worky who would you like to be appointed full time manager, assuming it was for a few years?”

    Fabio Capello.
    ———————————
    I meant realistically Worky!

  67. clint what i can gather he sat down with them and ashley ask who he wanted to keep hold of as shearer sed on tv not so long ago they could of kept hold of bassong and beye easily enough dont think he was that botherd aboot the others that left

  68. Tino 11 says:
    October 15, 2009 at 9:25 pm

    “Fabio Capello.
    ———————————
    I meant realistically Worky!”

    The last thing this club needs at the moment is yet another change of manager. That’s what sunk us in the first place.

  69. batty, do you think Shearer wanted loads of wedge & wouldn’t work within the limitations Hughton is?
    I just think that could’ve been the perfect situation for Shearer to learn how to juggle, build a team, get some smarts, build confidence & put down a marker for the future. He could’ve missed a trick.

  70. clint i just think ashley is doing it on the cheap i dont beleive ashley has even asked shearer m8 because i think he would be doing the job if he had

  71. batty says:
    October 15, 2009 at 10:24 pm

    “worky aye defo not me you would suss me any way but iam still pondering on you”

    batty, I’m going to turn Queen’s evidence on you if you don’t pack it in with the mischief making! Pick on Alvin Stardust instead. ;-)

  72. batty says:
    October 15, 2009 at 10:27 pm

    “worky are you still taking your trip to the hospital m8”

    That’s over for now batty. I just have be very careful about what I eat and drink and see what happens.

  73. worky i dont know what you think m8 but ive decided stardy is defo troy i got a little insight into the mind of stardust wen the billy bunter thing was going on hes very clever and likes a laugh bit of a split perso though

  74. Toon_Factor says:
    October 15, 2009 at 10:40 pm
    Batty, how come you dont write articles on here?
    <<<< i do just under a diffrent name worky knows and i like cartoons

  75. batty says:
    October 15, 2009 at 10:42 pm

    “worky i dont know what you think m8 but ive decided stardy is defo troy i got a little insight into the mind of stardust wen the billy bunter thing was going on hes very clever and likes a laugh bit of a split perso though”

    I can see what you mean when he was doing the “Oi Oi Charvas” thing, batty.

  76. Aye well maybe when Shearer stated last season that he was only here for the 8 games & that’s it, he meant it?
    & the rest is just media speculation.

  77. So worky, can you envisage a ‘culture wash’ any time soon?
    I’m not sure we’re ‘ready’ yet.

  78. Personally, i’d love to see David Moyes at the helm here at St. James’ Park, but sadly there’s more chance of Vanessa Feltz winning Miss World then that happening.

  79. See, that’s my point Shiver, who ‘could’ we get?
    Again, Moyes would be good, but, like you say, can’t see it happening.

  80. I wouldn’t be upset to see someone like Alan Irvine get the job. A fair few Evertonians seem to have him marked down as the natural successor to Moyes, and he also has the ‘carpet football’ ethos beloved of Sir Bobby, no less.

    Failing that, if either Shearer or Hughton get the gig full time, I’d be happy enough and would back them to the hilt.

  81. We shoulda never let Irvine go.
    Ot Steve Clarke, or Carver, even Pearson is doing a good job at leicester.
    Anyway, i like the cut of y’jib.

  82. Clint,

    When logged in, click ‘Profile’ on the login section on the sidebar. Then scroll down to ‘Profile picture’, click ‘Browse’, then upload a picture of your choice from your own machine. Finally, click ‘Update Profile’.

  83. “workyticket says:
    October 15, 2009 at 9:19 pm
    Excelsior, hats off to you too, for fitting so many tired cliches and ridiculous fallacies into one little comment.”

    Ah, Worky, consistency be thy name. Still, no show without Punch…eh! “Cliches and Fallacies”? People in glass houses…and all that.

  84. I’ve just finished reading through all of this from last night and no one has put forward a decent argument for Shearer apart from it’s Shearer, so why not?

  85. Micky Toon says:
    October 16, 2009 at 8:57 am

    Apart from strength, courage, passion, affinity, commitment, longevity, tenacity, loyalty and “It’s Shearer, so why not”…..you’re right Micky, I see no reason why he should have the job.

    After all, look at the vast panoply of top class managers who are kicking the door of SJP in to do the job!! We’re spoilt for choice really….aren’t we? Aren’t we?

    With Shearer we can actually BUILD something meaningful…from the ground up. Something to last, something in which, not only we, can be proud but all the generations of Toon fans to come after us.

    We are at a crossroads now, in more ways than one, the next step for this club is vital. Take the wrong one and we’re back to square one….take the right one and, in ten years time, we can look back and say: “There, see that, that was our defining moment…that was the moment we became masters of our own destiny.”

  86. MT, it is hard to argue for an unproven manager. I suppose if I had to argue for him I’d say:

    – he’s good on dressing-room discipline,

    – he’s keen to rebuild the club over the long-term and has developed a plan to do so,

    – he can unite the fans and will be given time by them to complete the rebuilding process,

    – he’s a strong personality who will fight his corner with the board.

    The big question is whether he’d be a good manager or not. Instinctively I think he will one day, but that’s not proof and ‘one day’ might not be now. He was only in charge for 8 games in dreadful circumstances and, like Hughton last season, he didn’t do particularly well. Had we got a point at Villa then things might be different – he’d have done the job and, no matter how unfair it is to judge managers on such short spells, the judgement would have looked more favourable.

  87. Excelsior, Hugh, I see what you are saying, but you, like me are seeing this from a fans point of view. Players probably see Shearer as a peer. Shearer hasn’t been away from playing the game long enough for players to see him as an old player who was good at his game and has now moved into management.
    We put Shearer on a plinth. He is above us mere mortals as someone who has lived our dreams. He played #9 for NUFC, and it did an ok job too. :-)
    His motivational skills really shined through, last season. If he had half the passion and motivation that people tell me he does then he would have had no trouble in at least motivating the team to a draw or two.
    I’m not convinced, but willing to be proven wrong.

  88. MT, I’m not fully convinced about Shearer either to be honest. I’d hope he could do a good job of management but there’s no way to know that right now.

    I think much depends on who’s up for the job. I’d prefer Shearer to Kinnear or O’Leary simply because I don’t like either of those, but if someone like Curbishley made themselves a candidate I’d probably settle for him instead.

    I’m not fully convinced about Hughton although he is going up in my estimation all the time.

    To be honest what I think is more important is that someone is appointed for the long-term (3-5 years) and that the owner sticks with whoever that is in all circumstances bar serious relegation threat, giving them time to build and develop a team. In some ways I’m less fussy who they actually appoint (although obviously a better manager is ideal) than I am about getting consistency and stability.

  89. Micky, you’re right to point up the “Hero Worship” of Shearer as being a negative. We shouldn’t be blinded to his shortcomings by how we feel about him as a player. If 8 months was not enough, at Fulham, to judge Sir Bobby Robson (all those years ago) then how much less 8 games to judge Shearer.

    Sir Bobby’s managerial credentials revealed themselves, over time, at a small, unfashionable club called Ipswich Town…which he only left when his country called. Now, I don’t know whether Alan Shearer has it in him to be the next Sir Bobby Robson (his massive ego and, well documented, self regard would seem to preclude this) but are we really to abandon him as a potential manager when: (a) There are no credible alternatives on the horizon. (b) He’s champing at the bit to do the job. (c) He, probably, has the best chance of uniting this club again. (d) He’s, probably, the only man who would be given the time, and unqualified support of both fans and (new) owners. (e) Even if he fails….better then to have tried, and failed, than never to have stepped up. Never knowing whether the key to, finally, unlocking the potential of this club….this city….was within our grasp all along; and we simply lacked the courage to use it.

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