Newcastle United’s two forgotten players

Jamaal Lascelles and Karl Darlow

Lascelles and Darlow: “Outstanding lads” says Pearce

In the misery and inertia of Mike Ashley’s Newcastle United, it is good to try and look for the flowers in the cracks of the concrete from time to time to keep oneself sane.

With this in mind, I could have written about younger players like Ayoze Perez, Rolando Aarons etc but then I thought at least we have seen them play in black and white, albeit briefly in Aarons’ case. On the other hand, two more of United’s biggest hopes the the future haven’t been seen at all in Magpie colours. They are the two forgotten men of Newcastle United, 21 year old centre back, Jamaal Lascelles and 24 year old goalkeeper Karl Darlow, who have returned from their loan season at Nottingham Forest.

Signed a season ago from the Tricky Trees for an undisclosed fee which was said to be £6.5 million, the pair were immediately loaned back and forgotten about by many on Tyneside. They are both regarded as very promising players though, and as Alan Pardew used to be fond of saying, ‘It will be like two new signings.’ As for whether Ashley will be making any more fresh signings like Darlow and Lascelles this summer, you can find all the best transfer rumours here.

Before he was captured by the Magpies, a few bigger clubs had been giving Lascelles the glad eye from an early age; certainly Arsenal and Everton, with the latter even being fined £45,000 for making unauthorised contact in a bid to make a daring swoop on the youngster way back in 2010. Manchester City and Liverpool were also said to be interested too at various times. This was mostly because he is a defender who can run with the ball, pass it very well and has pace too. A kind of anti-Mike Williamson if you will. However there seems to be a consensus that he still needs a little time to refine some of the rashness of youth.

Meanwhile, the slightly older Darlow is perhaps a little further down the road and he has also attracted interest from bigger clubs too. The more mature keeper managed to hold his place in the Forest side better than Lascelles – Where the latter only made 27 appearences for Forest in all competitions, Darlow made 44 as the Tricky Trees’ first choice goalkeeper. He made 45 the season before that too and has proved himself at Championship level at the very least.

As you can see from their introduction to Newcastle video below, both seem reassuringly articulate, well behaved and boring, more Theo Walcott than Nile Ranger. However, my investigations show that Lascelles certainly seems to be very keen on the Rn’B nightclub scene as there’s more about DJs and night clubs on his Twitta than there is about football sometimes. However he was cleared of all assault charges after an alleged incident in a Derby night club over a year ago.

Though Lascelles might be slightly behind Darlow in his development, both have now reached the stages where cliches such as “lots of potential” and “one for the future” are starting to become less relevant as they should soon be one for the present. This makes it even more interesting to see how they will develop in the coming season.

You can see Darlow in action below for yourself too with some of his top five Forest saves for the below. Take the following with a pinch of salt if you wish, as I must confess I haven’t seen a great deal of Darlow apart from League Championship highlights shows and the odd cup game, but from what I have seen, though he might not rival Tim Krul in the immediate future, he seems to be a far better prospect for the club than Rob Elliot if the Flying Dutchman comes a cropper.


TOP 5: Karl Darlow Saves For Nottingham Forest

If I haven’t seen alot of Darlow, I have seen slightly less of Lascelles from the same sources, and highlights of him in action online was harder to find apart from general highlights of Forest games, but here’s both in action as Nottingham Forest eviscerated a largely second string West Ham team 5-0 in the FA Cup the season before last. It was a very good game for Darlow and he pulled off some excellent saves to keep a clean sheet in the rout.

I’ll let others who know more than myself speak for the Lascelles and Darlow from now on, and there is a common theme there. The first is from Stuart Pearce. Whatever you might think about him as a manager, he’s should to be a very good judge of a defender when he sees one. Speaking on both players, old Psycho said:

“They are both outstanding lads, without question. Their character is first-class. However, I don’t think they are ready yet to go straight into the Premier League. Both the club and the fans will have to give them time and encouragement. They are potential rather than the finished article.

“Darlow more or less played in my first-team regularly, but Lascelles not quite so much. He will require a bit more time.”

Despite his note of caution that they are like a fine Claret which has still not quite reached its perfect drinking age, he certainly seems to think more of them than Paul Dummett after he said of the latter on Radio 5 Live:

“I thought he was an average full-back, but as a centre-half… wow, he’s been awful,”

Meanwhile, Forest fan and Mirror correspondent Daniel Storey gushed the following about Toon’s forgotten two:

“As should be expected from a 6’2” central defender, Lascelles aerial presence is a real asset. He shows an impressive leap and has fended off the majority of strikers. This, in a division as physical as the Championship, has been particularly impressive. Lascelles is also strong in the challenge, making those tackles that make supporters stand up and applaud. For a defender of such a young age, he certainly gives as good as he gets physically. Despite that, this is no lump. He has pace and would prefer to play short passes into midfield rather than look long. Having been schooled not to panic under pressure and be relaxed with ball at feet, he practices what he has been preached. Finally, whilst he would prefer to play in a central area, the defender also has the temperament and stamina to operate at right-back. In that respect, comparisons with Chris Smalling may be fair.”

He also echoed Pearce’s thoughts about Lascelles not quite being the finished article yet though.

So there you have it. Overall, there are some good young prospects in the Newcastle United squad, not just the two subjects of this story but players like Perez and Aarons, as well as slightly older players like Cabella and DeJong to look forward to next season. However it is awful coaching, injuries, tactics and motivational skills from Mike Ashley’s overpromoted backroom staff which has been the real problem. Give them a really good head coach, not someone unrealistic but someone like Ronald Koeman at Southampton, or even Quique Sanchez Flores, another ‘head coach’ who will be fronting another selling club at Watford. If clubs like Southampton and even Watford can get managers of that calibre, the current situation at Newcastle is ridiculous.

avatar NUFCBlog Author: workyticket workyticket has written 1052 articles on this blog.

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68 Responses to “Newcastle United’s two forgotten players”

  1. 1
    avatar chuck says:

    Yes they appear to be good (value for money youngsters)
    but at this time I would prefer to see some signings, that reflect the clubs ambition, the finished article so to speak.

    A defender like Celtic’s Dutch defender Van Dijk, also being checked out by Potchetinno, someone who could immediately fit in to the side and young enough to fit into the Ashley signing policy (apart from his price of course)

    It’s also been rumored that Irelands midfielder James McCarthy presently at Everton is unhappy, due to not being offered a raise, that, plus Everton’s recent signing of former Man. U’s. Cleverly, who plays in in the same position.

    Actually I much prefer McCarthy, who is a bit more physical and plays both the defensive and playmaking roles, much like Cabaye did during his stint at the Toon.

    In which case we could end up with two youngsters with plenty of quality playing time ahead of them, McCarthy especially, having broken into Scottish football at sixteen continuing to improve by the season.

    But I just don’t see our dear leader springing for either, being neither are out of contract or would come cheap.

  2. 2
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck, I’ve heard that Van Dijk’s a bit of a dick anyway.

    Even though Newcastle United should have a better squad for a club of its size, it is still has a good mid table squad like many sides who do much better. The incompetent coaching and boardroom situation is the real problem.

    Having written that, Alan Pardew’s stats at Crystal Palace so far are like a manager of a top four team. For a start, his win % at Crystal Palace is over 57%, that’s better than all but the top three teams in the Premier league last season. He could have got another Manager of the Year award for form like that! Jose Mourinho won the Premier league one and Eddie Howe won the LMA one this year.

  3. 3
    avatar chuck says:

    Worky

    Never heard that, but then there are plenty of thing that go on at football clubs which are kept from the public gaze.

    There’s certainly been enough interest in Van Dijk from EPL clubs and no doubt he will end up at one of them in the approaching season

    As we await with bated breath for an appointment that was expected months ago, there has been some action on the coaching front, with both “Clark”,(the Geordie one not the Jock, Steve Clarke) and surprise our former hero “Big Al Shearer” both lobbying for a job as assistant to McClaren.

    Now I don’t think much of Clarke an ex player, who has had his eye on the job for some time, being he has had a bit of success, but nothing remarkable and we have all witnessed wor Al’s debacle during the relegation season, where he actually looked worse than Carver.

    And since when did being a Geordie qualify anyone to manage NUFC, I would have thought the best men available, would be the criteria and I certainly don’t consider either of those two, as the best available.

    Plus there’s that personal dislike between Ashley and Shearer, better he pontificate on tv with the rest of those boring ex players who will never really be considered pundit’s, being most were chosen not for their verbal skills and wit, but for how many goals they scored.

    I’m afraid the same applies to coaching roles, the number of goals scored, does not translate in any way to being both tactically astute or enhance the skills of individuals, well perhaps to a degree, but management for the most part is learned over a period of time and it doesn’t hurt, like in Mourinho’s case to be an understudy to someone like SBR.

    Are we waiting for the close of the ticket window, or what, everyone is aware of McClaren’s arrival, why not just announce it, unless there’s some squabbling over money, the fine print, that the lawyers love.

    Andre Ayew has been dismissed as “not value for money”, being he’s a free agent I take it, it’s about wage demands, therefor will end up at Swansea, there goes another of our targets previously mentioned, how many more will we miss out on, until we are left with players no one wants, where is the sixty million we were told was available and is the stalling tactics of the club a part of the overall plan.

    Last time we were told we had people lined up but ran out of time, what excuse can we expect this year, I mean does anyone trust either Ashley or top management, having been screwed so many times before ?

    Plu ca change…….

  4. 4
    avatar workyticket says:

    chuck says:
    June 10, 2015 at 6:00 pm

    “Worky

    “Never heard that, ”

    Chuck, It was my shite joke. Van Dijk – Dick. Geddit?

    “Andre Ayew has been dismissed as “not value for money”

    That was “reportedly” in the Chronic though. Life is too short to spend time believing Lee Ryder’s drivel, or even reading it.

    It could be Steve Round as the assistant.

    I just read McClaren’s first sycophantic interview about how Ashley’s Churchillian speech of “verve” and “vigour” persuaded him and I felt sick.

    “The key thing for me was the statement that (Ashley) made at the West Ham game, when he actually came out with drive and determination and focus, and talked about the objectives and what he wanted to achieve. He said it with such verve and vigour that everybody was convinced, everybody was rejuvenated through that”

    “He said it with such verve and vigour that everybody was convinced, everybody was rejuvenated through that he gushed.”

    http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/mike-ashley-interview-persuaded-steve-9429927

    He obviously watched a completely different interview as the rest of us, it’s just blatant bollocks just like Pardew when he arrived. It’s going to be like him all over again.

    McClaren out!

  5. 5
    avatar chuck says:

    Worky

    Yeah sometimes I don’t get the implications, bit slow on the uptake I guess.

    You surprised by McClaren ?

    When, following an undistinguished career you end up being fired by a second tier side, what choice do you have when offered a job managing in the Premier League, even when you understand it’s a no win poisoned chalice gig, with little control over the why’s and wherefores.

    FFS even Pardew had had enough and he has a skin like a fecking rhino.

    No the majority of fans are unconvinced thank goodness.

    I guess McClaren will be just another in a list of failures, who will remain for as long as he can hack it, then like the rest collect his pay off and take a hike.

  6. 6
    avatar workyticket says:

    The appointment of McClaren looks like exactly the same thinking as the appointment of Pardew. A manager who had a moment years ago before it all went off key. Pardew had just been sacked by a League One club, and McClaren has just been sacked from a Championship club. Ashley gambles on picking them up off the floor on a cheap deal in the hope they can recover some of the old magic and he gets “value.” Newcastle United have just gone back to the point they were at four and a half years ago, and we could be about to live through much the same again. It reminds me of Nietzsche when he wrote of eternal recurrence in ‘The Gay Science:’

    The greatest weight – What, if some day or night a demon were to steal after you into your loneliest loneliness and say to you: “This life as you now live it and have lived it, you will have to live once more and innumerable times more; and there will be nothing new in it, but every pain and every joy and every thought and sigh and everything unutterably small or great in your life will have to return to you, all in the same succession and sequence – even this spider and this moonlight between the trees, and even this moment and I myself. The eternal hourglass of existence is turned upside down again and again, and you with it, speck of dust!”

    Would you not throw yourself down and gnash your teeth and curse the demon who spoke thus?… Or how well disposed would you have to become to yourself and to life to crave nothing more fervently than this ultimate eternal confirmation and seal?

  7. 7
    avatar workyticket says:

    I see Moncur has finally been given the order of the brown nose with a seat on the board alongside McClaren, yet Beardsley hasn’t been rewarded for all his brown nosing efforts. It looks like McClaren could be an even bigger brown noser than Pardew on initial performances, and with him being on the board too which is another odd move. You usually keep managers separate from the board.

  8. 8
    avatar workyticket says:

    Only Sky and the Mirror are allowed to speak to the club now. It’s like Robert Mugabe or Kim Jong Un are running the club. The ticket deadline ended on the 10th. I wonder how many they sold? That would say alot.

    “Newcastle United again accused of ‘gagging’ media as Mirror and Sky Sports emerge as ‘preferred media partners’

    http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/newcastle-united-again-accused-gagging-media-mirror-and-sky-sports-emerge-preferred-media-partners

  9. 9
    avatar chuck says:

    Worky

    Yeah unfortunate for him, Nietzsche never had the opportunity to try a massive dose of valume or experimented with Peyote like Huxley, it might have lightened his perspective some.

    Listening to some of the reported conversation, coming from McClaren, it appears he is as much in the dark as to who is about to come and go as the rest of us.

    It’s as if Carr, Ashley and Pudgy are playing a game of poker, one not showing his cards to the other and McClaren is watching them with a bemused look, not knowing what he got himself into, though mouthing all the right cliché’s that he can come up with.

    The more things change the more they stay the same !

  10. 10
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    workyticket says:
    June 11, 2015 at 10:29 pm

    “Only Sky and the Mirror are allowed to speak to the club now.”

    Interesting that he’s getting into bed with the Mirror, worky, considering the number of negative (constructive and honest) articles printed in both The Daily Mirror and The Sunday Mirror sports pages about him last season.

    They were the first of the nationals to get on his back and, for a while, they seemed to be out there on their own.

    I wonder what the reason might be for this rapprochement?

    With any luck, the other Bingo Boys noses will be so far out of joint that they’ll step in to give him the occasional dig.

  11. 11
    avatar workyticket says:

    DarthBroon says:
    June 12, 2015 at 2:07 am

    “Interesting that he’s getting into bed with the Mirror, worky, considering the number of negative (constructive and honest) articles printed in both The Daily Mirror and The Sunday Mirror sports pages about him last season.”

    Darth, I don’t know about a constructive and honest story in the Mirror nowadays, whichever side of the fence it claims to be on. Simon Bird (Mirror), Alan Oliver (People), Lee Ryder and Mark Douglas (Chronic) are the Mirror groups NE football people. I rest my case M’Lud. :-) The club’s relationship with the Mirror has never been that simple. The Chronic is the Mirror Group as well and just look at how they go from sycophantic arse licking to war and back again.

  12. 12
    avatar workyticket says:

    chuck says:
    June 12, 2015 at 12:37 am

    “Worky

    “Yeah unfortunate for him, Nietzsche never had the opportunity to try a massive dose of valume or experimented with Peyote like Huxley, it might have lightened his perspective some.”

    Chuck, back in Nietzsche’s day, they were off their tits on drugs. They were legal and available all over the place. You Yanks were the big killjoys who were determined to ruin the party in the 20th Century. :-)

    “Queen Victoria’s coterie ordered opium from the royal apothecary. She is also believed to have taken cocaine gum with a young Winston Churchill. Prime Minister William Gladstone is said to have taken opium in tea or coffee before making important speeches…”

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-16681673

    When Nietzsche wrote the words I quoted at 6, he was taking very large quantities of Opium to sleep. He also used to take Chloral hydrate, which is like barbiturates today as well as other things. I read he smoked a bit of hash too, allegedly.

  13. 13
    avatar Chuck says:

    Yeah ! I guess those were the days, (late 19th century)where people (mostly those with money) in western Europe indulged themselves.

    Paris through it’s connection with Indo China (where opium is still widely in use, imbedded in the culture) was a center of opium use, having clubs dedicated solely to it’s use.

    Of course we are all aware of the fact a war took place when Indian grown opium was forced onto the Chinese market by the British, perhaps it should have been called the tea war or trade war, which it was really about.

    In fact it’s thought Kipling himself indulged, during his time spent in Injah ! as did a number of other well known writers and governing class

    I suppose hallucinogens didn’t become popular until the early twentieth century, in the form of Peyote, mainly a ceremonial use by native Americans in the US southwest and Mexico.

    LSD a chemical sometimes found in tainted flour was responsible for turning on an entire French village, having ate the bread made from it, that must have been quite a trip, for the entire town

    I don’t remember the exact date, twentieth century, It
    took quite some investigation before they discovered the culprit (the local baker)

    From there the chemists soon figured out the chemical makeup and the manufacture of LSD and others, liquid meth, ice, the disco dance drugs of the eighties and raves of the nineties, that’s of course not to discount that steady use of nose candy that has remained popular throughout the decades.

    A multi billion dollar industry, who’s reason for being is dependency, but more so its illegality.

    One has to beware of those who inact laws that are for ones own good, take for instance the Prohibation era in the US that and to-days present drug laws, which differ from State to State, some states have legalized grass, but the feds don’t recognize it as legal (states rights, it becomes confusing)

    Which caused and continues to cause gangsterism, corruption, murder and reaches into the very heart of the largest banks and centers of government, who have a somewhat corrupt constituency that depend on it’s illegality.

    Be careful what you vote for, as it’s much easier to enact laws than to get rid of them, the Patriot Act, the Special Powers act, still in effect since WW1, licencing laws in regard to opening and closing hours for businesses etc., all nonesence, but fortunately “Big Bro”
    is looking after our interests, yeah right !

    I recently read an article, seemingly innocent, where Ireland will now have a post code for each individual home, no not the area where they live, but each home.

    If that’s not the enth degree in planning for total control, what is ?

    But then, this rant is probably already stored by that enormous cloud-like NSA area still uncompleted in Utah and by British GCHQ.

    Who cares ! it has always been the nature of governments to expand their control over their citizens and we are heading for a brave new world that neither Huxley or Orwell ever dreamed of.

  14. 14
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck, magic mushrooms, magic cacti, magic truffles etc have been around almost forever so tripping isn’t just a 20th Century thing.

    As for the Opium Wars, it wasn’t so much different from what we see today with the WTO.

    Don’t worry too much about postcodes in Ireland, worry about GPS mobile phones, chips in cards where we just waft them past readers and pay for small items we didn’t pay for with cards before etc.

  15. 15
    avatar chuck says:

    Yeah ! I know what your sayin.

    I observe to-days general public, who are pouring their privacy directly into both the governments and private sectors information banks.

    It’s a fact that those particular users of personal information, know more about the individuals, than they themselves know.

    Owners of the most simple cell phones, are tracked on a daily basis through triangulation, no you don’t have to have a GPS, it’s backed up by CCTV, which films everywhere one travels and the oyster card covers subway travel.

    I have seen people become almost totally cashless, using debit and credit cards for the smallest purchases, which venders allow being they could lose a tremendous amount by instituting a minimum purchase rule.

    The goal being to introduce a totally cashless society.

    So it’s known where you travel, what you eat and where, how much you spend on other things, entertainment, standard payments from banks, for such things as mortgages, utilities, you name it.

    It has become impossible to fly below the radar, by those who are interested in controlling you which is both governments and those interested in separating you from your money.

    But does anyone care ? other than those who look on these controls as something undesirable.

    And if one mentions the subject, especially those younger people who never experienced a time when one could be fairly anonymous and who to-day are infatuated by modern technology, which from my perspective is general used for the most banal of purposes, many leading a vicarious existence through their electronic devices.

    Of course, the standard idiot reply is, well what are you complaining about, these modern devices are made for our benefit to simplify our lives and what are you worrying about, if you are not involved in anything illegal.

    Yeah sure, big bro. would be the last one to harm you or take advantage, Being they only collect information to ensure the right people get he attention they need.

    Well at least the last sentence is true.

  16. 16
    avatar chuck says:

    Looks like Charlie Austin, is no closer to signing for NUFC than anyone else, at least that’s a reflection of what he blogged before erasing it.

    The more I hear the more it looks like the club is attempting to find cheap youngsters from the second tier, why I don’t know, because we already have a side stocked with second raters, why add more, it’s only a recipe for relegation.

    I mean FFS does this man realize he is bound and determined to have the club relegated, by applying his cheap-ass retail policies to football, one would think that this last season would have made him realize exactly what he doesn’t know.

    It’s time to open the purse strings, look at our neighbors who it’s rumored are attempting to sign Van Dijk from Celtic, while I suppose “Next”! “Chubby Charnley” is attempting to low-ball every target we may have in mind, it’s just depressing.

    This club needs some quality up front and across the back four ffs, go spend some money, now!

  17. 17
    avatar workyticket says:

    Well it was daft, the idea of paying a ridiculous £20 million or whatever for a player like that would be ridiculous, as was the idea that Chelsea are after him as well. Steve Austin was only $6 million FFS.

    It’s bizarre watching all these ignorant idiots on their mobiles all walking around looking like they’re completely mad, shouting to themselves and knocking over little old ladies.

    Do you have loyalty cards at big supermarket chains over there? That’s another one. As for the Oyster cards, I remember that you had to fill something out with your name and address on it when they were first around. That isn’t the case anymore though. Of course, they can still track the record of your movements on public transport if they actually take the card off you though. If you don’t have one you pay far more generally and they are no cash buses in London now, it’s all Oyster cards and contactless cards.

  18. 18
    avatar chuck says:

    One thing the fans at Newcastle can forget about is that contrary to what has been rumored, that there would be big bucks spent on bringing in quality players, it seems the opposite is about to happen.

    You can bet your ass, that none of the big names mentioned, will be seen at St. James’, unless it’s visiting with another side.

    Seems the ticket window has once again been extended, but apparently the fans have had enough of the clubs bull**it and are about to use their muscle in only spending after Ashley leads the way.

    A case of bring in some quality players and you can guarantee a full house, a pay for what you get system, if you will.

    Fool us once (or more at NUFC) shame on you, fool us twice shame on us.

    And I know I should give McClaren a chance, but I have absolutely no regard for the guy following his sycophantic performance on day one and only expect a Pardew mark 2 performance from him.

    Plu la chance……

  19. 19
    avatar chuck says:

    Worky

    For years, police forces around the world have got away with some of the most blatant crimes, from corruption, to criminal attacks and murder on civilians, etc.

    Face it there’s nothing the cops like more than a good riot against the general public, where they can rely on the system to defend their actions, with many police riot’s pre-planned by the system.

    That and the number of murders that have been whitewashed
    by similar systems.

    It now appears that the general public have wised up to the fact they have the perfect weapon to defend themselves, is the smart phone which can record whatever has taken place, using both audio and visual.

    Plus the fact that there’s usually more than one citizen involved recording, which only recently caught a cop grabbing a young woman’s phone and smashing it to the ground and kicking it, who was recording their treatment of a civilian fortunately recorded by a fellow onlooker.

    I certainly encourage civilians to film these police vs civilian engagements that appear to represent the police as going beyond a certain physical response, that causes injury to the victim, as it causes the police to pause for thought and rids them of that old attitude I’m above the law.

    Also not to show bias, it should be enforced by police departments, that active cops are equipped with an individual camera, that records all altercations or incidents they are involved in, which records the entire situation and end the, he said she said individual argument.

    All of which, could hopefully reduce court time, cost
    and result in a more responsive system of justice.

  20. 20
    avatar chuck says:

    It’s been reported that former Fairs cup legend Bob Moncur, has been appointed to the NUFC board.

    His role wasn’t specified, but from recent interviews, one would suspect a role as PR man or apologist, would suit him perfectly.

    Good we need that! something that has been missing from the club for some time.

    It appears this could be the season everyone has waited for, with a great new ex Engerlad manager (rated by many players as a top tactician) who will have a massive war chest (rumors of six or more million) to invest in what will be an almost new improved version, young talented player who in addition to those already at the club, aught to win at lest a top six place and champions League football.

    No I didn’t say championship football, that’s not where we or Mr Ashley want to go, that’s why he has decided to invest big bucks, and oh! they will be playing an entertaining style, you know a bit of flair and a lotta goals.

    So all of you guys who may be hesitating, get on the phone and get your season ticket’s now, as I hear there’s a great deal being offered on the eight year seats.

    But you gotta hurry as they are going fast and you wouldn’t want to lose out.

  21. 21
    avatar workyticket says:

    I would love to see the season ticket sales figures so far, judging by all the extensions.

    On Bobby Moncur, I wrote something similar elsewhere but he reminds me of Marshal Petain. In the First World War, a French national hero who captained his side to victory in Europe. In the Second, an infamous collaborator with the Nazis who was eventually found guilty of treason.

  22. 22
    avatar chuck says:

    Yes ! are we lucky or what? just think of those other sides in the PL, having all kinds of problems signing top stars, poor old Man U. being forced to sign only top players for outrageous amounts, in order to keep those contracts for shirts and endorsements.

    It’s a rat race folks, most top sides on a treadmill of spending heavily just to stay in place, one wonders if it’s all worthwhile.

    While lucky US, we can pick up players on loan and others out of contract, not to mention the best young prospects of the lower divisions and still avoid relegation.

    In fact we should all be relishing this approaching season, with our brand new manager, who having just come up from the second tier, knows all of the potential stars there, to be had for peanuts.

    With a solid base of players to build upon, i’m looking at an eventual youthful side that will possibly surprise even the top clubs in this the most difficult league in the world.

    Yes sir folks, it’s onward and upward for the club this year, with a big thanks to our generous owner Mr Ashley, who had the nous to make the necessary changes and back it up by spending possibly in the hundreds of thousands, to restock the club, in order to play those extra games on our way to winning cups.

    And oh ! don’t forget to call and either renew or get yourself a choice seat for what could be one of the most entertaining seasons in years, better hurry as they are going fast.

  23. 23
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck, I suppose you’ll be voting for Trump next year now he’s standing for President? Just when we think our politics are bad over here… ;-)

    I’m going to be voting for my MP, Jeremy ‘Karl Marx’ Corbyn for leader of the Labour Party over here.

  24. 24
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    workyticket says:
    June 16, 2015 at 2:00 pm

    “On Bobby Moncur, I wrote something similar elsewhere but he reminds me of Marshal Petain.”

    Indeed.

  25. 25
    avatar workyticket says:

    What an unbeleivable rant. I didn’t mean to watch all of this but I couldn’t stop once it started. The Yanks are determined to bring about doomsday. Bush, Palin, now Trump and another Bush as well.

  26. 26
    avatar chuck says:

    Worky

    Ermmm NO !

    Actually I don’t vote as it’s a complete waste of time , a fraud and a choice between “tweedle dum” and “tweedle De”.

    All of the rubbish about freedom and American exceptionalism, with Manifest Destiny being the greatest land grab in the history of the world, the boastfulness and hypocrisy and bully boy tactics, just completely turns me off, not that it’s any better elsewhere of course.

    Though finally there’s a candidate that might change my mind, “Bernie Sanders” someone who is respectful, thoughtful and ticks most of my political boxes.

    Unfortunately it may be a Bush vs Clinton re-run, as it appears it has become a family thing these days, neither of who are particularly bright and both families one being New England modern day carpetbaggers who made their money in the west Texas Oilfields, and of course Slick Willie, who came outta poverty in Arkansas, it’s apparent the presidency and politics has done no harm to both families in a monetary sense, plus politicians have obviously paved the way, in the sense it could all be considered quite legal.

    The fact is K Street the home of the lobbyists, control the who’s and why’s of politics, with the billionaire class contributing unmatchable wealth that dominates the year long political circus, making it almost impossible for any independent candidates, or for anyone not willing to be bought by them.

    Plus the two party system, just doesn’t work.

    Know what the description of an honest politician is in the USA, someone who stays bought.

    Ah well! as long as one recognizes it for what it is….

    Though I would love to see lumpen proletariat contribute to “Bernies” campaign and give the system a fright, somewhat similar to the present situation in Spain, The “Podemos Party” of the disenfranchised and unemployed, which have just won the Mayorality of Barcelona and has become an interesting phenomena, one that is certainly quite similar to what which took place in pre civil war Catalonia.

    And I believe one to watch, could be if successful the blueprint for many countries who have an increasing separation of wealth, maintained only be welfare for the billionaire classes, by dominating the political system.

  27. 27
    avatar chuck says:

    And of course “The Donald” is no more than a joke, who will do irreparable damage to his reputation by making it obvious he has no clue and should realize that before he makes it obvious to both the American public and the world.

    On the other hand, most of the candidates for the republican party nomination are equally bizarre in their
    agendas, we sure got diversity here in the US of A.

    One normally only found in circuses, which is fine, being the road to either party’s nomination has become the new reality show, not much different to the rest.

  28. 28
    avatar workyticket says:

    chuck says:
    June 17, 2015 at 4:29 pm

    “And of course “The Donald” is no more than a joke, who will do irreparable damage to his reputation by making it obvious he has no clue and should realize that before he makes it obvious to both the American public and the world.”

    Chuck, you’re forgetting that George W. Bush was president twice and look at him!

    Almost everything they say is pure bs but at bottom what has happened in both the US and the UK is a shift from the economics of John Maynard Keynes, which gave you stuff like ‘The New Deal’ over there and shaped the postwar recovery of the UK and Europe over here. There was then a shift to the economics of Friedrich Hayek in the 80s with Thatcher and Reagan. Since then it doesn’t matter whenther whether you vote Democrat or Republican, Labour or Conservative, we just can’t get away from that model. Ever since the eighties, poor and average people have been getting poorer and the rich have been getting richer.

  29. 29

    They both have potential but they need to be given the opportunity to express themselves. I’m sure that McClaren will give them a shot, hopefully they’ll grab it with both arms as it would mean that they would be better than whose currently playing.

  30. 30
    avatar chuck says:

    If you are talking about both being Luke Remy and Cabaye, sure two very good footballers, who believed their own press, resulting in being sat more than playing after finally reaching their goals of playing for top sides.
    Success is only relevant when you play regularly, better a big fish in a small pond than a good bench warmer.
    but have no fear, location is also a large part of the equation, most imports preferring to play in the capital and why not.

  31. 31
    avatar workyticket says:

    chuck says:
    June 17, 2015 at 11:34 pm

    “If you are talking about both being Luke Remy and Cabaye,”

    Chuck, I think he means Darlow and Lascelles? That’s what this piece was about. It seems they are the two forgotten men as far as you’re concerned! Darlow could be very handy if Krul gets knacked in the first few games, which is the sort of thing which could happen knowing Newcastle. Lascelles could blossom into the centre back you’ve been crying out for too.

  32. 32
    avatar chuck says:

    Oops guess I missed the point !

  33. 33
    avatar chuck says:

    On watching this evenings “Cupa America” game between Brasil and Colombia I realized the majority of those playing, actually were assigned to European clubs, where they made their living.

    Most being either Spanish or Portuguese employers, with Russia , Holland and various other countries having a share.

    Of course some may remember this is not the first time I have brought up the subject of why so few of these players either end up at EPL clubs directly, most being transferred from the above mentioned countries.

    My point is why if we supposedly have such a great scouting system, we ignore the Rio Plata area and Brasil, where so many of the worlds great footballers are developed.

    I mean does that make sense, or do most English clubs still believe that they can rely on home grown players to fill the ranks of the most wealthy league in the world ?

    I believe it’s nonsense and if they want this league to remain both the wealthiest and most entertaining, it’s about time they set up decent scouting systems throughout South America.

    But can you see Carr, barely able to comunicate a coherent version of English, compete or understand in an environment where Spanish with it’s various accents are spoken.

    Better we hire our former winger and Peruvian national player, the renown Nobby Solano, who has remained a friend of the club where he had his most successful time and could no doubt organize the procurement of perhaps some of the best young talents in not only his native country Peru, but also in the River Plate area where he played before being spotted and signed to a European contract.

    How much would it cost, say compared to Carr and his lot on the Euro-Rail circuit, nada !

    Hell it’s worth a try, unless you prefer to buy these talents for ten times the price from those other European clubs who see the bargains involved and invest in a scouting system in that rich vein of football.

    But then what the F**K do I know about South America and it’s football, well I can tell you, a hell of a lot more than most at NUFC obviously.

  34. 34
    avatar workyticket says:

    chuck says:
    June 18, 2015 at 6:51 am

    “Better we hire our former winger and Peruvian national player, the renown Nobby Solano, who has remained a friend of the club where he had his most successful time and could no doubt organize the procurement of perhaps some of the best young talents in not only his native country Peru, but also in the River Plate area where he played before being spotted and signed to a European contract.”

    Chuck, I remember that the Europa League was fantastic for scouting players, and there were a hell of alot of South American ones to look at there. It gave me the chance to see alot of players from leagues which you don;t see on the TV. For instance we saw Brazilian Willian when we played that Anzhi lot, though I always knew he was out of Newcastle United’s league. The one that excited as a genuine prospect that Newcastle could get was Carlos Bacca with Brugge, who were open to offers for him at the time. Indeed, they ended up selling him to Sevilla for around £7 million eventually. He was playing for Columbia last night, I think he got sent off after the final whistle though. He’s way out of our league now and would cost over £20 million.

  35. 35
    avatar chuck says:

    Of course one only has to look at the big and even mediocre European sides to realize what they would look like without their South and central American imports.

    There are those clubs who are aware of the importance of a good scouting force in the area and who buy young players with potential, directly and cheaply, well relatively cheap, a much better deal than buying the finished product from a fellow European club.

    Of course this applies to not only South America, Asia has been producing their own players for years many of which have ended up playing for big European sides, which of course doesn’t hurt the clubs shirt sales there.

    To imagine this way of doing business by NUFC reflects how poorly the club is being managed, missed opportunities are obvious everywhere.

    Yes the club has had a history of using foreign players from as far back as the Robledo brothers from Chile in the fifties, but they were not bought from there, nor were any who had successful careers at the club since and yes there were poorly organized signings under our former owners that were unsuccessful.

    Which is my point, neither enough thought or money was invested, just as at present we choose to ignore Asia, Central America, the Balkans and other areas.

    Concentrating on mainly France, The lowlands, Spain and Germany, definitely a lack of foresight, but then that’s nothing new for our present owner, who from his lack of understanding of the business and refusing to hire those who could improve the bottom line, just stumbles along, both aggravating his customers and attracting bad publicity for Sports Direct by their association with him and his predatory business practices.

    His insistence on oversight (control) is stifling the club and he has to begin listening to those who understand both how to gain a maximum return by reorganizing the club in a manner that covers all bases, that includes both success on the field and the bottom line.

    But don’t hold your breath, waiting for it to happen.

  36. 36
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck, to use one of your favourite exressions, “horses for courses.”

    Southampton is one of the best player factories in Europe, they have nurtured British talent of the highest order like Walcott, Bale, Oxlade-Chamberlain, le Tissier and many more, even Alan Shearer. They do have quite alot of players from Europe, South America and Africa now, but they’re developed players in their twenties who have come from other English and European clubs. The ones they’ve developed from youngsters though are mostly British, though one of their latest big ticket items, £20 million+ Morgan Schneiderlin is French and was bought as a youngster from Strasbourg for about a million.

  37. 37
    avatar chuck says:

    Worky

    Yes we are all aware of how well Southampton are doing, both on the field and in the development of home grown youngsters.

    But think about it, how many home nations players are there playing for continental sides, in comparison to the number of South Americans ?

    Yeah makes one think, even the number of non home grown in both the PL and second tier tells the story, which is
    the production of competitive youngsters in the UK is way down.

    I understand that the EPL pays (apart from NUFC) the highest wages, therefor attracts players from various countries, but contrary to claims, it certainly is not the best football league, those foreign players are more attracted not by the quality of the football, but the wages available.

  38. 38
    avatar chuck says:

    In comparing the difference between NUFC and Southampton.

    Both clubs have wealthy owners, with NUFC having an edge with around an average stadium attendance of some fifty thousand every other week, whereas S’hampton hold around the low thirties.

    There the edge ends, with S’hampton a much better run club, being they hire professional’s, both for the business side and playing side.

    Whereas just look at the present situation facing McClaren, he will be dished up a mixture of players like Pardew was, many who will probably not be his choice, but based on future considerations (sell on value).

    The argument being, this is the new continental style, managers being reduced to coaching roles, with little input into their choice of players.

    Yes and I agree a Director of Football is a good idea, but there has to be cohesion between both he, the coach and of course the scouting system.

    Not the chaos and infighting and a meddling owner, that exists at NUFC., it’s a recipe for disaster.

    IT appears McClare cant even find anyone to take on the coaching roles available, being the club has become a toxic dump in regard to careers, with most players here to place themselves in the shop window (Sissoko, Cabaye
    Debuchy etc)

    How does management expect these players to perform, with no real attachment to the club and face it the fans have been completely taken out of he picture, traumatized
    with a combination of awful football and no future.

    One of the best loved clubs in the country has been reduced to a toxic joke, each season battling relegation
    and who is to blame, well you don’t have to be Sherlock Holmes to figure that one.

    Wonder how the eight year ticket’s are selling, with nothing happening on the transfer front and every player contacted giving the club the brushoff, even the coaches are disinterested, so what’s the incentive to pay for another eight years of watching more of the same.

    Ah well, what to do ?

  39. 39
    avatar chuck says:

    I take no pleasure in putting down an old ex Newcastle player, but it’s got to the point that obviously former team member of the side that won the last piece of silverware to arrive at St. James “Bob Moncur” is really selling himself, in an even worse manner than even those who preceded him during the Ashley regime.

    Please Bob stop this stuff , that is unless you really need the dosh.

    Board member, yeah sure!

    Nobody’s buying it, mouthpiece erm obvious.

    Shows you that Llambias wasn’t kidding when he stated during a drink ridden evening (doon the toon), something to the effect, “you don’t know how horrible we can be”.

    Well following Bobs elevation to the board as someone who may convince the fans Ashley is in fact a good guy with a great sense of humor etc. I have to wonder just how low this present regime has sunk.

    I really feel sorry for Bob if he needs the dough, but no one is about to believe this bulls**t and it’s about the lowest trick to sell tickets yet by any club in the PL,

    Yes sir folks this is the final nail in NUFC’s coffin, anyone who believes a word from this club while Ashley is still in control, is obviously an easily induced fool.

    As are those who continue to buy season tickets, who i’m sure Ashley considers no more than easily manipulated sheep.

  40. 40
    avatar workyticket says:

    I take it that you wouldn’t agree with this piece then, Chuck? It’s written by someone called ‘Michael’ who’s hates the fat bastard jokes and thinks Ashley has been the saviour of Newcastle United. I wouldn’t be surprised if it was a wind up.

    http://www.themag.co.uk/2015/06/forgive-forget-and-be-fantastic/

  41. 41
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck, this one will take you back, a Tyne Wear FA Cup Derby from 1956. It’s good quality footage for youtube but it isn’t very long, just a newsreel report. The Mackems won 2-0 and knocked us out though. Are the Mackem fans throwing dirt over themselves to celebrate scoring the first goal? Wouldn’t surprise me with that lot. :-)

  42. 42
    avatar chuck says:

    Yes certainly brings back memories of a happier time.

    That seething mass of flat capped fans jammed together, like sardines, in what must have been a fifty thousand plus attendance.

    Looking at views of the east terraces, I was surprised to see both the row of terraced houses and even trees protruding above the ground.

    And if one looks closer the can see an elevated line of fans at the extreme back, of which I was possibly one.

    Standing atop of the wooden fencing, at the very back, made from 12″x12″ wooden thwarts and uprights, standing closer to the Gallowgate end, which gave a great view of Bobby Mitchell, entertaining the crowd, with a display of dribbling and the occasional goal.

    Certainly a happier time for the fans than to-days discord.

    As for “Forgive and forget” I hope it’s a windup as anyone echoing those sentiments in this day and age, obviously needs help.

  43. 43
    avatar chuck says:

    In regard to what’s happening at present.

    I don’t expect much from the club, with Ashley controlling the purse string.

    With even less faith in (Chubby “NEXT”!) our GM to get the right players in, I mean the guy is a virgin in the process, but no doubt a cheap virgin.

    If Ashley really wants to see how a successful club operates, perhaps he should look at Southampton.

    On the other hand, it’s not easy to attract decent players to the extreme Northeast, face it most want to play in London, other than those willing to spend one or two seasons in the shop window.

    I mean does anyone expect to see either Sissoko or Janmaat here much longer ?

    Even clubs like Liverpool (a shit town) with their history, are having problems holding onto players, though an attempt at winning something and hanging onto our best players could act as an attraction for decent players to sign for the club.

    But for anyone to expect any real changes for the upcoming season, other than another struggle to avoid relegation, wise up !

  44. 44
    avatar workyticket says:

    chuck says:
    June 21, 2015 at 6:12 pm

    “With even less faith in (Chubby “NEXT”!) our GM to get the right players in, I mean the guy is a virgin in the process, but no doubt a cheap virgin.”

    You mean Chubby Carr, Chubby Ashley or Chubby Charnley, Chuck? Actually, ‘Chubby Charnley’ sounds like a good catchy, alliterative name for him.

    I’ve been studying Southampton. Ralph Krueger, the Canadian – German Chairman of Southampton was a footballer for Dusseldorf in the Bundesliga where he scored nearly 200 goals, but he was also an Ice Hockey player for Germany and an Ice Hockey coach too in Canada and Europe. He has also written a book in French and German called ‘Teamlife – Beyond Setbacks to Success’ and is a member of the World Economic Forum, where he sits on the Global Agenda council for New Models of Leadership. How does that compare with Lee Charnley?

    Despite making a fortune selling players, Southampton’s squad value has trebled in value since they were promoted to the Premier League. They have left Newcastle and Everton in their dust now and are only behind Spurs, Liverpool and the top four.

  45. 45
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    I suspect “Chubby Charnley” has a simpler brief than Krueger, worky.

    It seems all he’s required to do is buy in young, good prospects at bargain basement prices, often regardless of whether their preferred playing position is what the team requires – a bargain trumps all.

    And, of course, we’ll sell anyone at any time, regardless of whether we’re challenging for a decent league placing or not (and no consideration of a replacement before the player’s shipped out).

    I suppose there’s always the possibility that the accusations of cynical business deals over team considerations we’re laying at his door isn’t entirely deserved.

    Maybe he actually IS supposed to be building the side we want, and he just happens to STINK at it.

  46. 46
    avatar workyticket says:

    Aye Darth, but looking at clubs like Swansea and Southampton, they’re even doing as good or better at selling players on at a profit. Everyone knows Southampton have made alot of mega sales but Swansea sold Bony for £28 million (as I predicted :-) and also players like Ben Davies for about the same price as Debuchy, Joe Allen for nearly as much as Cabaye etc… and they’ve just got a £15 million player from Marseilles called Andre Ayew for free as well. They’re not going backwards like we are though.

  47. 47
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    I know what you’re saying, worky, and I agree. The whole thing’s a dog’s breakfast, right across the board. They’ve been fukking up in every way possible for the best part of a decade now.

    And, it looks like the rest of European football can smell a rat too judging by the lack of movement related to NUFC in the transfer market.

    Early days yet, obviously, in spite of many deals already having been done in principle ahead of the transfer window.

    But, if the rumblings from the people around the ‘names’ we’ve been linked with turn out to be true, we’ll be the last choice of anyone looking to make a move this summer – and who can blame them?

    The club’s a shambles and everyone in football knows it.

  48. 48
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    I’ve thought since Ashley’s clumsy interview on Sky TV that the extent of the post-relegation-scare improvements wouldn’t amount to much more than a genuine attempt at a cup run.

    Even that won’t be possible if the pre-season transfer dealings turn out to be as disastrous as they’re shaping up to be.

  49. 49
    avatar workyticket says:

    The GCHQ guide to online manipulation on forums, blogs etc from Edward Snowden.

    I’ve been following the development of this phenomenon for a while now. It all started with Israeli Secret Services when they developed ‘persona management’ software. This enabled Zionists to use and manage many different phony identities simultaneously to attack critics of Israeli policies online. Then there was the Chinese pretending to be English people with names like John Smith but saying that the Dalai Lama was really a bloodthirty Nazi terrorist who worshipped swastikas etc. Most recently, Russians have been using it in an attempt to mould western opinions about Ukrainian ‘nazis’. Now all kinds of people are using it includng companies like Newcastle United.

    http://21stcenturywire.com/2014/02/25/snowden-training-guide-for-gchq-nsa-agents-infiltrating-and-disrupting-alternative-media-online/

    The images in the link also shows who they think the real allies are too, the English speaking Western World War allies, ie US, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. No one from Europe at all.

  50. 50
    avatar Chuck says:

    Onemajor difference between Southampton and Newcastle is, we buy players in batches, regardless of position, for the most part having more consideration for selling on than building a team, whereas Southampton buy to replace those sold on or to strengthen the side jn general.

    Plus I’m sure each of the management side of things are in agreement,as to what’s in the bes’t interest of the side, unlike NUFC in the era of Pardew, where Ashley would it appears instruct Carr to buy the best sell one’s available, without regard of the needs of the club,resulting in resentment from Pardew and I assume Carr and he possibly fell out over how things were manipulated by Ashley.

    In such a situation, everyone from coach/manager , scouts and deal makers , it’s essential there be a cohesiveness of purpose, or as things worked out certain players who don’t fit into the managers tactical plans got to collect splints in their asses from too much time on the bench.

    As for the propaganda wars between nations, no one holds the high ground and those who consider their country’s people to be any better than the enemy during any particular era or of having higher standards than anyone else, is just another victim of propaganda, as propaganda is more often than not directed both to the home and away crowds.

    The billions of dollars spent during the cold war ,was mostly a waste of money, as the CIA were probably the most surprised organisation of any to realise the Soviets were throwing in the towel and reverting to being Russia once again.

    And it’s the opinion of many that Snowden and other whistle blowers by making public, what in most cases (rendition to let other countries do the torturing for you,)( by some individual commiting assasinations thousands of miles away, directing a drone armed with missilles kinda reminds one of the claim about Eichman, that he was no more than an individual who’s banality was to find ways to cost efficiently carry out a system of extermination of so called enemies of the state.
    Insanity !

    But boys will be boys unfortunately, and in this increasingly overpopulated world where the Malthusian theory is making a comeback , famine and wars have become an accepted means of culling humans and how are we to keep our military industries and arms sales without enemies at every gate, I believe the Saudis were in the top three of arms purchasers last year, oil in exchange for arms, he’ll they can’t even beat a country next door still living in the nineteenth century.

    Ift’safunny old world, ain’t it ?

    suppose famine and wars are a neccessary means of culling those numbers.

  51. 51
    avatar workyticket says:

    DarthBroon says:
    June 23, 2015 at 9:28 pm

    “I’ve thought since Ashley’s clumsy interview on Sky TV that the extent of the post-relegation-scare improvements wouldn’t amount to much more than a genuine attempt at a cup run.”

    Darth, on the cup thing, try to look at it this way for a moment:

    Ashley tells the manager not to pick too many of the better players for cup ties. Later, Ashley recants and Charnley and Ashley suggest we are going to try harder in cup competitions when the new manager hadn’t even been appointed yet.

    Either way, Ashley is dictating the the policy of the manager regarding who is picked for matches and that is bad, even when it sounds like a good thing superficially.

  52. 52
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck says:
    June 24, 2015 at 3:02 am

    “And it’s the opinion of many that Snowden and other whistle blowers by making public, what in most cases (rendition to let other countries do the torturing for you,)( by some individual commiting assasinations thousands of miles away, directing a drone armed with missilles kinda reminds one of the claim about Eichman, that he was no more than an individual who’s banality was to find ways to cost efficiently carry out a system of extermination of so called enemies of the state.
    Insanity !”

    Hannah Arendt, one of my favourites:

    “The greatest evil in the world is the evil committed by nobodies, evil committed by men with no motive, without conviction, without wicked hearts or demonic words by human beings who refuse to be persons, and it is this phenomenon which I have decided to call the banality of evil.”

  53. 53
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    workyticket says:
    June 24, 2015 at 3:06 pm

    Hannah Arendt, one of my favourites:

    “The greatest evil in the world is the evil committed by nobodies, evil committed by men with no motive, without conviction, without wicked hearts or demonic words by human beings who refuse to be persons, and it is this phenomenon which I have decided to call the banality of evil.”

    So. Not a fan of Civil Servants then, worky? :)

  54. 54
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    workyticket says:
    June 24, 2015 at 12:23 pm

    “Darth, on the cup thing, try to look at it this way for a moment:”

    I do realise what’s going on, worky. Honestly.

    The whole thing’s a load of bollocks. There’s no real intent to have a go at anything.

    The best we can REALLY expect is for the knee-jerk reaction to come in the middle of next season, rather than in the last four or five weeks.

  55. 55
    avatar workyticket says:

    DarthBroon says:
    June 25, 2015 at 1:16 am

    “So. Not a fan of Civil Servants then, worky? :) ”

    Eichmann was a travelling salesman for an oil company. Pardew always reminded me of a travelling salesman. I could just imagine him hanging his jacket on the little hook on the back door of his Mondeo or BMW and pumping his fist after making a deal. I’m not comparing Pardew or all travelling salesmen with Eichmann though. That would be harsh.

  56. 56
    avatar Chuck says:

    Worky
    It was the “banality”that hooked you, I knew you couldn’t resist it !
    There’s another one by by of all people Herman Goring, don’t remember it verbatim, but a shorthand version, where he states it’s easy to bend the will of the people,whether a parliamentary democracy, a communist or fascis dictatorship,etc.
    All one has to do is claim to bave beenattacked by a neighbour in order to get the population behind you, it works the same in every country.

  57. 57
    avatar Chuck says:

    How are the season ticket sales going, perhaps another extension in the works ?
    Hey ! Show us the money Ashley, cause most of us don’t believe you.
    Actually you may have to rely on the turntables, in order to fill the stadium and you don’t want that, I mean how many could you expect for a Watford game, as opposed to a top six side.

    And can we get off the Schnide and make some realistic bids, our patience is getting a bit thin.

  58. 58
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck says:
    June 26, 2015 at 2:34 am

    “Worky
    “It was the “banality”that hooked you, I knew you couldn’t resist it !”

    Chuck, it was Hannah Arendt and her ideas, not just the word “banality.”

    Aye, Goering. He also added that you must denounce all the pacifists for their lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It’s a scary how much you can learn about how the world works from the nazis.

    The huge irony though is that alot of the great strides in propaganda made by Hitler, Goebbels and the nazis actually came from the Jewish Ed Bernays, the nephew of Sigmund Freud. He brought psychoanalysis into propaganda. I think his first big thing was for Woodrow Wilson selling the first world war to you Yanks. He was born in Vienna but his family moved to New York when he was a baby. He literally wrote the book on propaganda in 1928. It’s still the bible for propaganda and advertising.

    http://www.voltairenet.org/IMG/pdf/Bernays_Propaganda_in_english_.pdf

  59. 59
    avatar workyticket says:

    BTW, there might not be too many more blogs on here the way things are going. Hugh sent me an e.mail saying he refuses to even read my e.mails, never mind answer them and he won’t answer my calls either. This has lasted over a month now which doesn’t bode well.

  60. 60
    avatar Chuck says:

    Worky

    Yes, no doubt makes for fascinating reading, something that i remember you introducing on this blog a while back, for the most part the result of gathering, analysing and collating the historical use of propaganda and to a degree explaining it’s use! both in a political and social circumstance.

    And yes, the Nazi’s took great advantage of it, also they resorted to a system of psychological warfare against many of their enemy’s especially those under their control, through confusing them and constantly changing policies.

    But in any case the previous point I was attempting to make was, are those piloting drones thousands of miles from any battlefield in remote areas of sayYemen or the Pakistani tribal lands
    any different than the Eichman as described by Hannah Arendt ?
    And who lauthorises who lives and dies and under who’s jurisdiction, being the button presser may and usually is located on a totally different continent.

    Could this also be the banality of an individual who considers pressing that button as if it were no more than that of delivering the final act of some video game or is it a conscious act that is recognised by that button presser and who would willingly set themselves up to be the cold blooded executioner of individual/s unknown to him on a daily basis,

    I mean does that not meet the standard of banality that she recognised in Eichman’s case ?

  61. 61
    avatar Chuck says:

    Worky

    So we may in fact be about to close shop ?
    Ah well all good things do come to an end.
    Though it’s been an interesting run, one gets the feeling they are at least conferring with adults, contrary to the average blog.

  62. 62
    avatar workyticket says:

    I don’t know, Chuck. I’m writing a blog now but as I said, Hugh sent me an e.mail over a month ago saying that he refuses to communicate with me in any form and he hasn’t. He’s in charge of the server so we might go to login into this site one day and it might not be here.

  63. 63
    avatar DarthBroon says:

    Blimey! What’s put Hugh’s nose out of joint?

  64. 64
    avatar workyticket says:

    Darth, it’s not fair to go on about it really, it’s between me and him. But he hasn’t been talking to me for over a month and I don’t know how that will affect the blog in the future so I’m letting you know just in case.

    Chuck says:
    June 26, 2015 at 8:05 pm

    “I mean does that not meet the standard of banality that she recognised in Eichman’s case ?”

    I see what your getting at but behind a simple phrase is something far more complex so I would suggest reading the book.

    There is alot of stress on the enormity of Eichmann’s crimes and the contrast with his personality. You can’t just throw the extreme example of Eichmann around willy nilly. Before his trial, he had psychaitrists all over him and they couldn’t find anything “wrong.” They said that if anything, he was too “normal.” However, though it goes against the idea that the nazis were all a very rare breed of fanatical psychopaths / sociopaths, one misinterpretation is the depressing and hopeless one that almost anyone can be a potential Eichmann, which Arendt also disagreed with.

  65. 65
    avatar Chuck says:

    Worky

    Of course it’s certainly a complex question which I recall during the actual trial how believable he was in using the “Nazi defence,” “we were only obeying orders”,
    .It was of course one of the most controversial statements of any following the trial, Arendt’s “banality of evil”belief , which caused a storm of controversy and is still debated to this day.
    Either Eichman was an excellent actor or a complete sociopath, who knows, but there were others , commandants of extermination camps for instance , who were considered both kind and loving parents.
    Then there were of course those who were totally unsuited to the task of mass murder as something personal, but who devised a more efficient way of extermination, saving bullets by
    using gas chambers.
    Treblinka for instance was a prototype extermination camp, where train loads of Jews and others arrived daily and with the minimum amount of German and Baltic states guards, went about the business of exterminating themselves, in an efficient manner using Jewish sondercommandos.
    These were specially chosen driven by the will to survive, who were super efficient at doing their described jobs.

    One of which was sorting clothes, their efficiency was ensured by a Nazi guard who sat on top of a pile off clothes to be sorted and every so often would shoot someone who was not up to speed , driving the others into a frenzy, speeding up untill they were exhausted.
    This type of psychology and others were widely employed by the Nazis, leaving eventual survivors feeling a guilt that they they never got over.
    No ! I see a somewhat similar situation, not exactly one that was pre planned of course, that of those who press buttons that kill others from the comfort of an air conditioned room, while sitting in a comfortable chair, not unlike playing a video game and doing so from thousands of miles away.
    If that,s not a question of both banality, legality and do the individuals involved ever either question of have any reluctance to their involvement in such acts.
    Seems we all have a certain guilt, but on the other hand it’s quite well known we are a very flawed spieces and will no doubt become more inhumane towards one another, with the continual more efficien means to do so.

    No I

    arrived daily and with a limited amount of Germans or Baltic state guards, Jews using sounder commandos, themselves Jews, went about the business of exterminating themselv

    I recall reading about treblinka which was a

  66. 66
    avatar Chuck says:

    Bit of fitba to lighten up, certainly doesn’t appear The Toon are that anxious to be relieved of their recent earnings, being the French have wised up and are charging the going rate these days, the same with the other leagues.
    Which raises the question, but what about our dear leaders sell on plans, which was a large part of the overal business plan and did last seasons signings indicate our heed scout is loosing it, as apart from Perez (who is still questionable) our other signings were for the most part flops.
    The idea of selling any of our top players (which we don’t have many) in order to subsidise bringing in others, is ridicules and if Ashley decides to do another cheapo transfer window, we are doomed, as to wait and see what happens between now and the next window could be too late.

    Time to dig deep fatso, unless you were lying to us (again) this club needs both quality and depth
    If we are to have that successful season (finishing tenth would probably be considered successful
    I believe)

    Hey! Most fans would at this time settle for a side that at least attempts to both play an attractive style of football and gives an honest effort, not a lot to ask.

  67. 67
    avatar workyticket says:

    Arendt’s stuff on Eichmann also caught hooked in with the famous Milgram experiments where they tested how far ordinary people would go in following orders, which was also wrong.

    I remember Arendt using contrary examples, looking at the Jewish Councils appointed by the Nazis who helped to select which of their fellow Jews should be sent to the camps. She also wrote about the Danes, a very small country who were powerless and completely at the mercy of the Germans. Despite being powerless, overrun and occupied by Germany, hardly any Danish Jews died in the death camps. When the order came from Eichmann, the Danes refused, the government resigned, and even more surprisingly, the Germans in Denmark went deaf and blind, allowing all the Jews to be spirited to safety in Sweden. When Eichmann went to Denmark to find out what the hell happened, even he backed down and called off any further deportations because of loss of face. Over 99% escaped. If that had happened in every country occupied by Germany then the holocaust would have been virtually impossible.

  68. 68
    avatar workyticket says:

    Chuck, did you fall asleep in the middle of typing comment 65?

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